Speaker 1: 0:01

what's up everybody? This is Decentral Lens. I am Blue Toshi and on my right is Disco. What's up?

Speaker 2: 0:08

Disco, how you doing uh, I'm doing well I'm. I'm uh captivated by the eyewear. You know I thought that I always had an interesting, an interesting look on the on the uh glasses, but you definitely took the cake with that. So excited to kind of recap with you some of the stuff because I know you made a a voyage down to Tennessee so it'll be interesting to kind of hear some of that stuff. For sure I'm very pumped for the show on the X.

Speaker 1: 0:29

But uh, yeah, so I wanted to. The Billy glasses were a very nice touch. Good job, bongo, and uh, the whole Billy team for making these and they had these nice. Uh, I went to the Bongo meetup at word house and they have these nice. Like I'm not a big t-shirt guy, uh, or cheap t-shirt guy, this is like a nice soft knit t-shirt with stitching and the Billy. So you know, if you're going to have a runes and we're going to round trip everything from a billion back to zero, uh, we might as well have the shirt. But a great party, billy, it was nice to meet a lot of you guys. And uh, uh, nashville was just awesome.

Speaker 2: 1:18

Wow, I'm excited to. I'm excited to dig in and hear more.

Speaker 1: 1:22

Yeah, absolutely so. Um where do we start Disco?

Speaker 2: 1:31

Do you want to start with Nashville or do you want to go? Um, uh, I didn't know if we were going intro or not. I didn't know if we were going intro or not, but if we want to just go enroll, um, there's a lot, a lot of different ways to look at this. Obviously, you know there are kind of it's interesting because you have these events right and they serve really well to pull people together. You know kind of IRL, where you've developed relationships and communications over time prior, but seeing people in real life is a whole different thing.

Speaker 2: 1:55

But we also know from some of these events that it's more so. You know kind of finding, you know, people that you're interested in outside of kind of the convention hall and I want to learn more about kind of some of the things that you may have come across there. And we can also talk, of course, about. You know, I hate to say the macro of it, but kind of the macro of the event, because there was certainly news that came out of it. It was one of the first times in my life where I was seeing mainstream media cover, you know, a crypto convention to the degree it did.

Speaker 1: 2:26

So that represented kind of a sea change. For sure, yeah, yeah, there's so much to cover there. But you're right, there is kind of two buckets. There's the personal bucket of the ordinal space and kind of the ordinals tribe, and then there's the much bigger RFK, obviously Trump, and then the non-news of Kamala Harris not going, which is still, I think, huge. But you know what let's do, that opening, and then we will get right into it.

Speaker 2: 2:50

Welcome to Decentraland's, your weekly 30-minute crypto report with your hosts Blutoshi and Disco.

Speaker 1: 2:57

All right, we've shortened the intro big time, but we still like it. We still want to do it, but we're going to call it. This show won't be a half hour, it's probably an hour. Um, and remember it is also on um, apple podcast, spotify, amazon music, youtube, so go there like it, uh, but we're not just here, because sometimes, like I talk to a lot of people in nashville disco and you and I even know this like we've got this beautiful studio.

Speaker 1: 3:23

We love talking about crypto, ordinals, runes, macro and everything. But as cool as video is, and we get the little pink moniker to the far left, it's not the downside right now is it's not something you can just sit and hang and watch like. So we are in all these other places, but I think, like audio spaces where they do have listenability afterwards and you know a lot of them get double and triple the numbers the video kind of like disappears after that. But just know this is a weekly show. We generally do it on Wednesdays and it's everything crypto and tying everything together, weaving the fabric from macro all the way down to Billy and awesome D-Gen runes. So we're here for it, we hope you're here for it and you know, if you like it, tell your friends and LFG.

Speaker 2: 4:18

Yeah, and just a little add on to that, I also look at it as a bit of a not therapy, but a bit of a catharsis. You know, as we, as we navigate the timelines and the news cycles and everything, it's like, oh God, I got to save it for the show. Oh, you know that's interesting. So you know it's. It is definitely a independent passion play at this point and we're looking towards the future and I do believe there'll be more and more of a um, more and more opportunity for video to be consumed in different ways as we go. So that's kinda, that's kinda where we are from that backup. But while, what would you say? What would you how? How would you kinda, what would you describe? Kind of the energy level? You know, in Nashville, uh, last week, like what was kind of the kind of I don't want to go, vibe, but you know what was kind of the feel for it?

Speaker 1: 5:05

Yeah, so we'll start with the individual like I met so many cool people.

Speaker 1: 5:08

Obviously, scribe, and I did a show uh with you for months on rsic and we met so many cool people in that space b ways, speed racer, um, my god, bad brothers, like so many of the people were there. Good Things, polymath, like. If I had to name everybody, I know I'd forget someone and be bummed about it, but I'll probably just keep name dropping the whole time because I think when you go to these events, especially when Ordinals and Runes are crabby to down bad right now ordinals and runes are are crabby to to down bad right now Um, you know, it probably didn't get as big of a turnout as it would have if we were just completely in a bull market. So, you know, scribe and I and, uh, steven Miller another one of my absolute favorites we went to the inscribe, uh inscribing event, that which started the day before, and it really made a huge conference full of 20,000 Bitcoiners. You know it brought the the hundred, 200, 300 of us, maybe 400 tops together. So it's it's kind of like my. My analogy is like you went to a huge college like university of Minnesota or something. There's like a hundred thousand people there like University of Minnesota or something. There's like 100,000 people there Like this is like, well, okay, you're in a Magic the Gathering club or a Pog club or, dare I say, you're in like a fraternity. It just makes the whole thing smaller and it makes the experience so much better.

Speaker 1: 6:40

In our last breakfast, scribe and Steven and I talked to mainstream Bitcoin conferences super nice guys and they were like, well, you know, your stuff is just spam. It took me like 30 seconds to dismantle that whole thing and be like, well, yeah, some of it is garbage, but a lot of it is immutable information online. What if there's something that the government changes their stance on? And then they literally whitewash what's happened in the news, like that's immutable on Bitcoin. And they're some of the greatest generative artists of Bitcoin as well. And they were like, I mean, it took me 15 seconds to sell them. They were like, well, we're not, we don't have that much conviction on it and these guys were awesome.

Speaker 1: 7:19

But my point is, with all these ordinals people coming together you know under what Casey built and Aaron and Raph and all these awesome people and Trevor who I met, who was a super nice guy, like super helpful, and said he wanted to come on our show and a show with scribe, like you know. So people I hadn't met before who are kind of in different collections and camps like I met and you meet people in real life and they're just most people Like. There was a couple people who have big followings. I'm not going to say who they are because most people probably know, but there are definitely some arrogant folks.

Speaker 1: 7:54

But the vibe was generally across the board like awesome to meet you and we can talk everything from Bitcoin mining to macro stuff all the way down to ordinals and runes and that's what differentiates our tribe and everyone probably here listening from everybody else. We can talk about Bitcoin and crypto from top to bottom, from art and runes and pure DGN all the way up to macro and energy consumption and energy capture and and replacement of like, like oil as an asset, like uh, so so it was. It was awesome from that standpoint.

Speaker 2: 8:34

Yeah, and that's gotta just feel good, because you know it's one of the things that happens to at least me, but I'm sure you know anyone listening where it's like you just want to talk about this stuff and you want to be able to not like bring someone up to speed, necessarily, or this or that. So when you can just kind of sit at a table or whatever and catch up with someone who you've, you know, followed or connected with through spaces or tweets or anything, and then be able to be like okay, dude, I don't have to explain to you what I mean by this or why I'm so geeked up on this like so how much do you really know when you're trying to kind of like filter that stuff with someone who may say they're into the space?

Speaker 1: 9:15

Well, and also like I met. You know I I've always prided myself on not being friends with like mainstream normies. Not that I don't hang out with them and, you know, play golf with them or play softball or whatever, but like when you meet people like um snoop toshi. This guy is literally a walking quantum computer. His interests are all from from a art like he. He showed us all these things he's working on and all these projects Like he. He literally you could tell he had 37 plates spinning at once and but when you were talking to him you had his full attention. So you know, a lot of those guys might be so fragmented in some directions, but when he was there he was one of the most fun guys in the room.

Speaker 1: 10:02

I would put Troy in that category too. Those guys were just like you know, I don't know what the best duo out there is, but they were just always having a good time but they were always introducing people. So like there's, you know, the. You know I was in there in that first weekend, but you know the OG, ogs or Casey and all the people who sat at the table with him, as this had pre-launch and stuff like that. You know I was there in January, february, but there there's an even older set that uh was there and we were all there together and it was fricking awesome.

Speaker 2: 10:37

Nice. So, yeah, you, you come across people, they're locked in and you're like it's just it's encouraging to see and then I'm sure you're hearing, you know about, you know maybe just makes you feel good that you know that people are really invested in building more and you're just kind of waiting for things to come to life that you know so many people are focused on and building on. So it helps your commitment.

Speaker 1: 10:57

Yeah, absolutely so, steven. Uh, absolute shout out to this guy. Um oh oh, I guess the goat part didn't come up. I'll have to fix the formatting on this.

Speaker 2: 11:11

What a surprise. You'd like that to show up. Yes, I know it's. It does say goat.

Speaker 1: 11:15

But Steven and I it was. It was awesome because Scribe described it best as your pivot foot and me it was just like who's who's on your Island. You know, like the cool thing is, even within those three or 400 people that you hung out with, there was like everybody had their you know good things and polymath and English, like they've got their crew. And, uh, one of polymaths were the good friends, jin, who was a super nice guy Like everyone. Everyone hung out with each other, but there's always those people like you're going to go back to over and over. So if you're at a party, you know the pivot foot, as scribe calls it is like you go talk to people, you know you kind of branch out, you meet new people and you know sometimes that's easy, depending on the mood you're in. Sometimes it's hard. But if you've got that pivot foot or that safety to go back to your favorite people in the space and for me again it was Steven, it was Scribe, it was B-Ways I mean there were so many and Polymath, I always, like, whenever I saw him, just wanted to give that guy a big hug. He's such a fascinating guy. Good things, I mean. There were so many folks and there's so many new ones.

Speaker 1: 12:23

I met, like this guy, avi from, uh, the West coast, like just like I think you hang out with the people that are on your frequency you know what I mean and like you just keep grabbing. Like I met the guy, like this Avi guy and like a Wednesday morning and you know that night, like you, cause we all went to the same parties you might take the same cab with them or not and you see them again. It's like a reunion of an old friend you haven't seen in 20 years. So there's definitely and we talked a lot about this there's definitely a frequency aspect. Like you, you, you create the core with the people you vibe with the most, and then you kind of branch out and there's a much bigger group that you just have a blast with. Like it was a lot to digest. I drove there both ways 10 hours. That was kind of a fun part of the trip too, but it was just exhausted coming home. But now that I've digested it, it was just, it was just super cool.

Speaker 2: 13:17

Yeah Well, you get it's kind of a payoff right Because you've you're talking about the alignment and kind of not necessarily an attraction, but a kind of similar view of things and similar interest, and then to actually be able to connect that and make it that translation into the IRL, it's a nice, it's a very kind of validating thing, I suppose. Like it kind of takes it to another level and makes it feel like a little bit more genuine than if you've only interacted virtually.

Speaker 1: 13:42

Yeah, and you build trust and you know, the funny thing is like that was just one, that was two or three, you know 12, 13 hour days of having a really good time. Oh, saxon was another one, a fellow shroom holder. The guy was just awesome, like and there it was interesting, like there was definitely like partiers and, and you know, depending on the groups you're in there, there was definitely a lot of like extracurricular drugs and stuff like that there, which was awesome. But I'm not a huge drinker and a lot of the people I hung with were just like, like super chill and like a lot of people didn't drink at all. Not that that needs to be brought up or an issue or anything, but the point was like it wasn't just like you know, coke on a table or anything. I didn't see any of that stuff. I'm sure there was party crews, but so many of the people. We just wanted to be there and talk about bitcoin, crypto, ordinals and and where the world is moving wow, I'm uh, I got.

Speaker 2: 14:43

I do have some fomo on it.

Speaker 1: 14:45

Yeah, it's like everyone was greatest.

Speaker 2: 14:49

It was all I'm like oh, that sounds fun. Um, I myself had a little venture, um, to celebrate an anniversary, um, and went to the land of enchantment and uh, kind of got a reset on that side of things. Um, they're, you know, just looking at you, you know kind of some of the artistic and spiritual things and stuff like that. So I definitely, uh, while I, while I have, uh, you know, guilt or not guilt, but I feel bad that I wasn't there, cause I feel like I missed out, I definitely did make the most of the time away. So we're feeling good, but I'm glad.

Speaker 1: 15:21

I did a good trip, but you missed out, but you know what you just, each time, you just build on it and you know, next time, like I already said, like I'm going to grab my favorite people, we'll grab a house or like you know, and then you can have like a home base and then, uh, so basically create it like a permanent uh structure, pivot foot and then go out. But, uh, the next one is in Las Vegas in may. Uh, we should definitely go to that, but there'll be plenty before then, probably art shows and the cool thing about you know, this is the biggest one. So you had three, four or 500 of us ordinals, folks all hanging, meeting, getting together, and maybe it was even a thousand, I don't know. But at these other ones now you could go to other ones There'll be smaller ones and be like oh hey, I met you at this.

Speaker 1: 16:02

So it's just, you know, over the years you just kind of build those relationships stronger and stronger. So in some on the Nashville front, the on the individual side, it feels good, cause what I've always said, uh to you specifically like back in 2017, whatever, my first crash was um, like you kind of you, kind of like first crash was um, like you kind of you, kind of like you feel the lows and highs more alone, and even if you're two bitcoin holders, like it's like it's different to say we're rich, we're poor, like it's like my bank account's bigger, my bank account's smaller, whereas if you're in ordinals and runes, it's so multi-layered where art is put on top of that and culture and all that stuff. So when you have a smaller tribe like that, I think it just makes the bonds that much stronger.

Speaker 2: 17:01

Yeah, that's well said and a good kind of recap of your takeaways from that from a more individual or personal perspective. And then when we zoom and look at, you know, as I say, from from, from afar, you know I'm getting reports from all sorts of different you know outlets about what's happening and what, what, what, everything means it's going on. You have, you know, some really big speakers. You know, and you know from Donald Trump to RFK, and you know kind of getting the distillation of the messaging. It's just incredible.

Speaker 2: 17:30

Some of the, some of the kind of newsy things I heard. You know, I heard the term Louisiana purchase moment and I heard the term currency of hope. So you start hearing these things you know percolating out of, you know, know that that um event and you start seeing just this whole. It's not necessarily this might sound stupid, it's not necessarily like the gentrification of bitcoin and crypto, but to a degree, when you start we saw it when we went to dc right, you started hearing them parrot out the things that we've been talking about for so long. But when you really, you know you have these major folks flying in, looking, looking to you know kind of align and say that they understand what they're doing. It's just really kind of fascinating. You know, in Trump's we can get into Trump's speech or you know anywhere we want to start. But you know, that was kind of the big headline right Was. You know, donald Trump actually came and delivered an address and from what I can tell it was extremely well received, like just yeah.

Speaker 1: 18:28

I think it was. But before we go there, let's go to the cause. You brought up two interesting points. You talked about Cynthia Lumens and and uh RFK, who actually spoke first, both of them in this concept of the Bitcoin reserve. So her thing, I believe his, was like four percent of all bitcoin, correct? Uh?

Speaker 2: 18:48

so that's over a million yeah, his plan is to transfer the existing 204 but then to buy I believe it was like 500 and 550 bitcoin per day until it hits a four million point, and then decide to purchase more or not. So really, buying that reserve?

Speaker 1: 19:08

yeah, so to buy 550 bitcoin a day, which is more than the daily supply of bitcoin available right now. We're at 450 bitcoin is mined every day right after the having. So this is buying, you know, and obviously these are our rfk. Even though I, like him, he's probably not going to win unless something crazy happens, but he is proposing that we buy 550 bitcoin a day till the price of bitcoin is 4 million no, I think, until they acquire till we have a net of 4 million in the treasury.

Speaker 2: 19:43

Oh, 4 million bitcoin yeah, that's what I believe.

Speaker 1: 19:47

So basically four or five percent of the total supply. What people don't realize is, when bitcoin is bought with the current supply, that it doesn't go. So if buying gets linear like let's say they bought 550 day and nobody else bought anything the price of Bitcoin isn't going to go up linear because there's only so much available to buy on the exchanges. I'll pull that chart up in a second. But the price goes up like exponentially or logarithmically if any of this stuff gets instituted.

Speaker 2: 20:20

Yeah, yeah, and it's almost the same blueprint that then Loomis proposed. I don't know if she spoke the same day later or the next day, but she has a bill out there for the US to buy 5% of the total Bitcoin supply as well. So they're very similar in kind of the net of that, and I completely agree from what you're saying. It's like dude if you start doing the numbers on these sort of buyers coming in looking to buy 5%. And again, that's one government. We've already talked for months and months about all these different entities, countries, states, everyone looking at it. So they would even be competing against Michigan and Wisconsin to get the assets. So it's really a mind-blowing concept to think about where we're headed for sure.

Speaker 1: 21:12

Yeah, 100%. This is one we used to pull up a lot in the early days. But this is the Bitcoin. This is just the last year. Orange is the price of Bitcoin. Obviously, in the last year it's gone up nicely from $20K to $60K. $70k is the price of Bitcoin. Obviously, in the last year it's gone up nicely from 20 to 60, 70 K.

Speaker 1: 21:27

But the green um is the amount of Bitcoin on exchanges, the number, if you will. And just look, I mean look at the area under the graph to the left to over here. It's gone down by at least what? Uh 40, 50, 60%, like right now the amount of Bitcoin we have on exchanges is uh 2.48, uh million Bitcoin. So it's it's not a lot, and you know, just in in comparison, like last, this January, it was 2.72. Uh, and I don't even think we've seen the big institutions come in yet there's. There's a lot we haven't uh seen from kind of who's even capable of buying a lot of these pension funds, that like there's so many banking regulations that have to happen before these ETFs can just get uh scooped up. But later in the show obviously we're going to talk about the states, like we just keep adding to the amount of states, but we'll kind of save that. So back to RFK and stuff.

Speaker 2: 22:29

But even go ahead.

Speaker 2: 22:31

Yeah, but even if you go back to the chart you just showed right, Like that's that's up to, that's real time, right. So that includes the Mount Gox and everything right, and that would also probably include the US government. They put the Silk Road money on there too. So you're seeing kind of these governments dump and move. The only way they can dump is to move it to exchanges. So that doesn't really. I just think that you looked at the Loomis proposal, what she said in RFK, and the greatest part about it is both of them said, hey, we want to get, you know, let's just say, close to four to 5% of the supply, and they all said they're going to hodl it for 20 years. So it's not like a, it's not an in and out. You know strategy. So that's pretty interesting.

Speaker 1: 23:11

Yeah, that's a good point. The uh at the. What he's alluding to in this chart, uh, for those who are listening, is the amount of Bitcoin that went on the exchange just recently, kind of like went up on a cliff. And you're right, because um Mount Gox says has already, we know, distributed to crack in. Uh, and we know the government's given a 2 billion of the Bitcoin to custody at Coinbase.

Speaker 1: 23:35

There was a lot of rumors, uh, two days ago that it was imminently to sell, but now we know that that was just for Coinbase, just a custody. So they're not. We've already heard that the US government is not planning to sell it. People thought it was like retribution against what Trump said and the Democrats in power were going to do this, but that's not the case at all. So, yeah, the number's actually gone up, but once the demand, I mean, it's just going to get bigger and bigger and the amount on exchanges is going to go down. Now everyone has a price for what they'll sell their Bitcoin at, but a lot of us holders I don't. I don't even know what my price would be Like if. If Bitcoin ripped to like three, 50 today, would you sell some? I don't know if I would like what are you going?

Speaker 2: 24:28

to buy, I would hold. I mean, honestly, the only way I would is if I had an IRL cash crunch or something that I needed to you know tie into, but I would. That would be last chance kitchen, like. The last thing I'd want to do is is part with that at all.

Speaker 1: 24:43

Yeah, for sure, Stephen's writing uh, more awesome stuff, but this is long so I'm just going to read a buying 5% of the Bitcoin supply isn't even necessary. All Cynthia Loomis needs is to convince Congress to pass legislation that can move the 5% of the Bitcoin currently held by the Homeland Marshals into a reserve fund. I didn't even think that their current stash what'd you say? It was Disco Cause I just did a. I actually have a tweet on it. I thought it was only 200,000. Hold on, I actually have it up right here. United States government. Yeah, it has 210,000 Bitcoin right now, so that's actually that's an easy one to calculate. That's actually 1% of the supply.

Speaker 2: 25:25

That was very convenient.

Speaker 1: 25:27

Yeah, I'm pretty good at math, but I'm like 21 million divided by and you know. Here's the other thing. I was before the show, steve, and if you're still listening, I was telling Disco that I'm doing a stat, because I know you and I were kind of talking about this at breakfast that morning that the amount of Bitcoin I think someone is going to need to kind of as this generational wealth transfer happens, it's not one Bitcoin, it's like my theory so far is it's 0.3. It's like a third of a Bitcoin, but it's not even that. That's just if you count the number of millionaires.

Speaker 1: 26:01

There's about 60 million millionaires in the world and that's a rough number triangulated through a couple of AIs and just Google searches. So, but let's just go with 60 million millionaires there's. You know we've lost at least a million Bitcoin, so there's 20 million Bitcoin. So there's three X millionaires to Bitcoin. If all those you know a to Bitcoin, a lot of those millionaires obviously probably have dabbled Bitcoin, maybe 10%, but a lot of them haven't. So even if all of them scramble to get in, each of them would have to split theoretically. If every Bitcoin was available which it's not, it's not even remotely close, it's like less than 5% available would have to split a third of a Bitcoin. That's before the pension funds, before the state of Michigan came in, before the state of Wisconsin, oh, by the way, before Hong Kong came in. Now I'm blowing point number five. I might as well just go to it.

Speaker 1: 26:51

Oh, no, point four Hold on, I'll get this. There we go. I mean, it's just absolutely insane the amount of states and pension funds and the amount that can't even get in yet, and that's not even to take into consideration the sovereign nations. Us has 204,000 Bitcoin and if they win even if the Democrats win, which they probably won't they're going to have to play nice with us, because what do we know now, disco? We know that the world's biggest super pack in the us whether you love them or hate them is fair shake.

Speaker 2: 27:30

It's crypto like is oh, isn't that insane? Like I couldn't believe that story. So yeah, they fair shake as a super pack past MAGA and became the largest, so AKA the most influential pack for the U S election. It's unreal.

Speaker 1: 27:47

Yeah, absolutely Unreal. Um, yeah, so I mean, all of these things are are kind of, um, I need to. Stephen, sorry, I apologize, I need to lower the font, but at least I get to put your face on there. You're beautiful, uh, face, he is absolutely one of the smartest people in the room and he was working by. He was working that week, you know, and I'm just like everyone comes up and people who want to pitch you will be like hey, what are you building? And my whole pitch was like you know, obviously we're doing the show and you know I know everything's constitutes building now, but I'm like I'm not building anything, I just love being here, I love Bitcoin, I love ordinals and I love runes, and then, of course, their. Their next sentence is like oh great, well, here's what I'm building. I'm like, ah, easy, we're going to like I have to be, I have to like you first, you have to be my friend. Like, I only collect art from people that I like. And if I want to know what art to buy, I asked Stephen Miller because he is the best art like analysis curator person in this entire space. But uh, stephen, that's, that's enough on you for now, for at least four minutes. Um, but yeah I, I just like everything is happening at once, like you know what. What we didn't even talk about is that.

Speaker 1: 29:00

You know Kamala Harris. She was in talks with the conference organizer. You know, obviously they're they're trying to do a crypto reset. The crypto reset. It's been a week now. That's not going so good. Like like we in crypto were like okay, I still don't trust you. Choke boy 2.0, like nothing's really changed, but she's going to have to. She cannot alienate the swing voters in swing States with crypto.

Speaker 2: 29:28

She has to because there are, I mean, remember, uh, sab and you know fit 21 and you saw younger Democrats go against the party and go against you know Biden at that point and actually, you know, vote to override the veto and all that so for them to break party ranks. That was the early indicator that there's more of an appetite than I think people thought within some of the elements of the Democratic Party to embrace it. Granted, there's a big credibility issue right now and I know that you know her team reached out to Coinbase and Ripple and some of the bigger players to try to have a little bit of a come here and let's try to get on the same page a little bit. But it's just the facts, what we've been talking about for the past six, seven months that there's too many people who are too passionate and too tied to the vision of this and the inevitability of what we're seeing with the positive transformation and implementation of this technology that you know now it's becoming almost geopolitical. When you to start, you know some of their legislators starting to say, hey, trump's legitimately talking about, you know, acquiring reserves and making this a real strategy for the US as a superpower.

Speaker 2: 30:49

You can't tell me that every other country is not, you know, baking in the same strategies as of right now. So we're in this arms race for it and you can't have it be partisan anymore, like it's just not going to age well and it's not going to help you in swing states, not even top of the ballot but down the ballot when you're on the ticket. When you start looking at you know some of these races. You start looking at Elizabeth Warren and Deaton. You start looking at you know some of the one of the races in Ohio and they're really kind of leveraging people's. You know response to crypto. So it's becoming more important than just hey, I'm pro or I'm anti. And you really haven't heard much from warren, which makes me a little nervous because you know she'll probably have a another fight or two left in her. You know kick or two. But the other thing we haven't said was trump's big kind of takeaway for all of us was he said gary gensler's out day one, like he said he will fire him on that's.

Speaker 1: 31:39

I think everybody's going to Gensler's done. Everyone's going to fire him. I'm sure he was a patsy for someone else in the choke point 2.0, but obviously I don't. I don't feel sorry for him at all, but along your lines of partisan politics. Um, there was an awesome study and this isn't on our docket, but there was an awesome study that came out by a guy that we met disco in um dc named troy cross and he and a couple other folks did an awesome study and the t and I'll post it on my timeline. Uh, no, I already did yesterday. I'm sorry, I forwarded. Check out my timeline. But the tldr is that. You know the?

Speaker 1: 32:19

The the thinking in crypto was that everybody mostly was right, we'll call it Republican in America or far right, and that could not be further from the truth. The actual majority of Bitcoiners are neutral politically and I know you and I thought, thought we just want a good candidate. You and I follow under that category. But neutral was a big one. The, the far right and left. Actually those were um a little higher compared to to the far right and left normies, but those were equal to each other. So there's just as many liberals as there are self-proclaimed liberals as there are Republicans, and it just goes to show you it's not a red thing, it's not a blue thing, it's an orange thing. You know, it's a full orange pill. That that it doesn't matter at all what political party you belong to, because Bitcoin again I know I say it every week, but bitcoin doesn't give a shit about any of us. Bitcoin just works and the reason that everybody is revolving around bitcoin. You know what? What's the whole thing like? First they try, and you know.

Speaker 1: 33:38

First they ignore you, or first they laugh at you, then they ignore you, and then they try and quash you and and silence and destroy you and then they join you and clearly you know, remember when we we started this podcast, like last september or whatever, remember like we were in a bear then and we went about a month. Remember you were like is is a bull about to happen? Like we had those spidey senses tingling and it was like, yeah, it is about to happen. So we knew and it's. You know, who knows what's going to happen, with the political turmoil and maybe one party not believing an outcome or something. Hopefully it's smooth transition, whoever wins.

Speaker 1: 34:16

But I think beyond that, like I can feel the inevitable. Like, even though Bitcoin, like it goes up in the 70s and it goes right back down the 60s, mid 60s, like we're all like how there's only good news, trump basically said he's going to do a reserve for it. So did RFK. Two of the three candidates have said like Bitcoin is going to be like the centerpiece of of their presidency. Yet the price just keeps staying the same and I guess it just it's like, well, now we have to build the big normie roads. They're coming, it's institutional and all our retail friends are going to get screwed because they're not going to get in again until it's a hundred thousand plus, and then they'll probably run for the Hills on the first little dip. You know, it is what it is, we know and the people that we know know and and you just got to ride it so that leads me pretty well to something I've been cooking up in my head.

Speaker 2: 35:10

It's not a tweet, it's just. It's not a take, it's just I don't know. They talk about like, oh, the democrats have to do a reset and everything like that. And you know, I'm thinking that disco needs to do a little bit of reset, and I maybe would call for some other members of ex-Twitter to think of this in terms of so we've talked about what's inevitable and we're all bullish, and we always end up being like oh, so stock sats and get into what you're into. And I feel like we need to take a little bit of time to focus not on the politics that we can't control. There's really very few actions that we can take right now that can impact our bags in a positive way. It's kind of out of our hands and in that point of inevitability. So I think I'm going to work really hard over the next few months to go back to focusing on kind of the wow and the wonder and the good that can come from these kind of turbulent and fast turbulent times and this fast developing technology Like we're at a point where it's making me super bullish on art, like I want to see what's being created right now, what is going to be the art of these times, and I can't wait to see what brilliance comes out of kind of this madness that we're seeing, from kind of a political thing. I mean, think about just that, you know, the fight picture after the assassination attempt, like that's going to be around for freaking ever. That is an incredible capturing of the chaos that we're kind of just living in day to day and I just want to know, you know, what else will we see? That's either real or performance and, most excitedly, what are these great artists right now creating that I haven't seen or experienced yet? Like what's going to be the soundtrack to these times, what's going to be the new punk, the new graffiti, the new hip hop, the new dance movement, the new generational voice? Who's the Salinger that's going to come out of this? Who's the next Vitalik, who's the next Cobain? And it's like I haven't seen that really come yet.

Speaker 2: 36:54

And I was in a place that was very artistic centric, you know, for the last week, and I just had a lot of friction with it because it was focused on art that wasn't relevant to me anymore, which was traditional art. It wasn't of the moment it was of you know back, you know Georgia O'Keeffe times and this or that, and I'm not disparaging the impact that that artistic movements and stuff have made, but I have yet to really see the kind of culmination or the output of these new tools that we have. And I'm just sitting there promising myself that I need to focus more on searching out and finding the people that are really groundbreaking and making this new change, and I think that it's going to be incredibly positive and exciting and exhilarating when we start seeing some of these things come to life. You see them, with some of the, you know, some of the artists who have already adopted, you know, or inscriptions and stuff like that. But there's going to be more and there's going to be, you know, nate, digitally native artists that are just going to blow our minds with what they come up with.

Speaker 2: 37:52

So I'm trying to focus on that for, like, at least the next month or so when, like, congress goes into recess and we're all kind of waiting to see what happens with the election, like, this is a time for me to go back, to go back to the point of wonder and you know that, that beginner's mind and be like what can, what can be accomplished and what are we going to see come out of this. And who knows, maybe I'll come up with something creative and an output as well. But it just really inspired me to be like we're in a new way, the new age. The page is turned Like let's see what this digital you know, I want to say digital but what this next generation of art can really become.

Speaker 1: 38:23

Nice, I dude, I love disco Like uh.

Speaker 2: 38:27

I.

Speaker 1: 38:27

I have a close here. Here's the disco closeup button. Just for those moments Like I love your hot taste so no, but it's awesome.

Speaker 1: 38:36

And for those in the audience who don't know, like, disco and I grew up together and he got into crypto in 2021. He bought Pico Top A lot of his friends did too but he stuck around and a lot of people left. I got in in 2014, 2015. Got lucky that it just happened to be a low in the cycle, but I've been studying it. I never look back. Been studying it ever since, but I didn't have to Because I bought low. I never looked back, been studying it, uh, ever since, but I didn't have to because I bought low. I never had to worry about, like being underwater for a cycle.

Speaker 1: 39:06

And you did, and you've always been in the arts. You had a music company for a long time and you know cause. At first I'm like dude, like the artists. I can introduce you to lemonades, I get into auto and to Billy Retzky, like all these awesome artists. But no, you're talking about a whole culture movement. You're talking about what? How's the music going to change now? You know like we've already heard so many different um, you know like uh, raps and different musical songs on Bitcoin, and most of them are trying to be funny and kitschy so they can get on like a show, but you're saying like, where, where is the? You know? Because I always contend that that we here in crypto and certainly ordinal's runes, even more so like we've created a tribe, the, I think, for normies out there looking for like what's the epitome of cool. Now, I don't think you're finding it like in the bars and the pool halls, like with the hush puppy shoes or anything. It's here, it's online, it's virtual.

Speaker 1: 40:06

You know, you and I are older, it's, it's not an age thing. Like the first thing you asked me when I got home was did you feel like people were like, oh, and like we'll let the old man go hang out with them? I'm like it was, it didn't you know? And of course, I said I look kind of young from my age, so I get away with it. But but how about vanity? But nobody did, nobody gave a crap. Maybe like, as I said, with the frequencies, like the 20-somethings would hang out more, with the 20-somethings as their pivot foot and stuff, but every but like. There was not once where I was like, oh, that person's super young or that person's super old. I can't speak for the young folks, but I didn't feel that at all. I feel like Bitcoin just transcends all that, because if you know, you know, you know.

Speaker 2: 40:53

Yeah, and is like, is it like? Is Elden Ring, you know? Or are these games kind of the new representation of like? I'm not sure exactly what it is yet, but I just can't wait to like really start seeing the impact, generational impact, of people playing with these tools and creating things that I couldn't fathom. You know it's no longer like six strings in the truth, or you know anything like three chords in the truth, or you know, I've never heard six strings in the truth.

Speaker 1: 41:19

I've heard three chords in the truth.

Speaker 2: 41:20

Yeah, dude, but you know, I've never heard strings in the truth. I've heard three chords in the truth. Yes indeed, but you know, it's just like that's what's so cool and that's what you know when you see a new movement and you feel it. Basically, I think movements, art comes out of movements, right? So you had, you know, the frustration with the, you know the unemployment in England, and all of a sudden punk music came about and did that.

Speaker 2: 41:39

So you see these things come out of that and I just think, with this insane, you know, day to day, when we're getting different algorithms and we're having, you know, divisiveness in your feed, and you know you kind of had this almost futility of like you know what's the point, because they're not going to hear what I'm hearing or they're not going to listen to what I'm listening. Going to listen to what I'm listening. Art's got to spawn out of that and I think we're just almost about to see it and I'm going to do my best and maybe I got to hit up Steven more on the side or or pay more attention, cause it sounds like he's front lining that. But I'm really want to kind of take my focus away from you know, just echo chambery. You know, you see there's different group chats or whatever, and it's like they're talking about things that they really can't control.

Speaker 2: 42:19

You know, like oh maybe this is what happened and it's like just maybe this brutal pop, if x, y and z happens and and you know I, I've, I've got a bag of runes, and I know so do you, and and I hope I, I do think at some point that runes will go.

Speaker 1: 42:35

I think when you can buy them, you know more it's, it's more fluid. You know whether it's on a sex or a decks where you can buy them, not in blocks but but um, much more liquid. But I, I think a lot of these have a chance to run, like our sick and Billy and and a whole bunch more. But I think someone made a really good point in Nashville I think it was scribe saying that um, one of the reasons that Solana did really well with like bonk and some of those other ones is it was Scribe saying that one of the reasons that Solana did really well with like Bonk and some of those other ones is it was infrastructure and kind of utility first, and then it kind of turned into the hottest coin. Bitcoin just kind of skipped that because Casey was like well, BRC20 sucks, so we're going to make runes way more efficient so it doesn't choke the network with two transactions every time someone wants to trade. But you. But he built the utility, but no runes to this point really have utility.

Speaker 1: 43:27

I assume at some point we'll see one that's a stable coin. Maybe I don't know. Obviously, you need a freaking whale for that, but runes may be the simplest, cleanest way on top of Bitcoin's L1 to be that. But we'll see. I think our sick guys are still working. But Liquidium came out with something yesterday. They had an eight ball in it and people were like that's it, it's our sick, and Liquidium's like sorry, it's not our sick.

Speaker 2: 43:58

Sorry, folks.

Speaker 1: 43:59

So there's definitely some cope there. I do think they're building a. I do wish they communicate a little more. But um, why? I think you and I've just kept quiet, we've just been patient on it, because I think looking at the space is a greater hole. You know, you kind of make some bets, but if you're going to make meme coin bets, like be prepared to lose too, because you know, unless it's a cabal of influencers which we know exist out there like with the rug radio guys and a lot of these ETH guys were coming over Like if you're not on the inside, you're probably you're probably going to get pumped Right and you're probably going to get out Pico. You're going to be exit liquidity, like I was for cat and sats.

Speaker 1: 44:37

I mean, I've had a, a lot of wins, but most of my wins were just stacking real sats and bitcoin. So, like I said, I'm going to come out with a tweet. But if you don't like, even like a third of a bitcoin, you know and, honestly, once I do the math, I think it's going to be like 0.1 bitcoin. So what are there? 100 billion sats at a bitcoin or something like that. So that would be like a 10 billion or something like that. You need 10 billion sats and you should be set as this transfer of wealth happened.

Speaker 1: 45:07

It might happen in a year, it might happen in 20 years, but just, you don't even need a full Bitcoin anymore. If you can get to one, I highly recommend it, but if you can't, I think the number is going to be way smaller. Because once we get these state actors, these Goliaths coming in, these big companies, like it's like once you figure it out, you can't like once somebody at Apple whether Tim Cook has to leave or not like once somebody at Apple and the finance group sees it, you can't unsee it Like, fine, maybe you don't put all 126 billion in there, but God put it, put 30 or 40 or 50 billion in. At least you know and watch your company grow without even having to sell a product.

Speaker 2: 45:49

So so let me ask, let me ask you this, cause it just came up and I don't really understand the question I'm about to ask, cause it's being formulated as I speak but are we, if you're inordinate amount of wealth right, do you think we'll just start referring it a lot more to just the amount of sats, as opposed to the point of Bitcoin?

Speaker 1: 46:14

At some point it will have to transition to sats. I think one of the reasons Bitcoin was not adopted quicker is because it's still in BTC A lot, lot of normies you got to remember. I mean, you probably know this better than I do. They don't realize that you can buy 0.006 bitcoin. They just it doesn't even. They don't know it goes to eight decimal places, you know, whereas sats the sat is the smallest unit of bitcoin. So now your eight decimal place is over, right, right. So there's your 100 billion. And yeah, I think eventually it will If Bitcoin goes to a million or $10 million, or what Michael Saylor was saying, his bull cases. Wasn't it like 37 or 64?

Speaker 1: 47:03

I mean this is by 2045, right, this is like the next generation. But if it gets adopted even remotely that fast, like multi-million dollar Bitcoin is not out of the question, in which case we can then go to sats. Because think about it psychologically if you're like, yeah, you know, I worked my ass off at the, you know, the joke in this industry is like going back to being a drive-thru guy at the McDonald's, like I'm working my ass off, and if you can just save and if you can put a hundred dollars in and that's like 240,000 sats I'm just making I don't know how many sets that is but.

Speaker 1: 47:36

but it sounds a whole lot better to be like just keep stat and sats, be like I've got a million sats, I got a billion sats now, Like that's a lot better whole numbers or a lot more comfortable to normies than 0.006, which you and I both know is actually not a teeny, tiny amount. It's several hundred dollars, right.

Speaker 2: 47:59

Yeah, and not only whole numbers but large quantities make you feel better too. So if you're sitting there saying you have a million sats, you're like, hey, I'm covered off, I got a milly billy, you know yeah for sure. That's why. That's why.

Speaker 1: 48:15

I like, early on you were like, hey, this, like I've got, we've got a bunch of these tokens. I'm like, yes, there's 2 trillion. You're like, oh, is that bad?

Speaker 2: 48:23

Be like, yes, you, you, you always want to make sure the denominator isn't too large, right yes, I remember being cautiously hopeful about like runes mania minor before the happening, because I had just a huge grip. I'm like, well, if that does something, we'll be in great shape and and it did not a lot of them. I did meet the room and he's still building.

Speaker 1: 48:45

He was super nice. He's from uh, I think it was one sweden or norway super nice guy, though. So I mean, there are people continuing to try and and build out their um room guardians. I know, uh, um, nicolian it's always hard to pronounce that name is built like. A lot of these guys are building. I just we have to see if it comes back or not. And, um, I was saying a couple of weeks ago on one of the spaces probably a good thing, show that first, before runes or before ordinals have a chance to rip. It's probably going to be Bitcoin to make people feel rich there. Then runes technology is going to get a little better. Some runes will rip. Those guys will get rich. They'll want OGs like Shrooms or OMB or Node Monks or whatever they want. So I think the order is definitely some runes will pop at some point in the next year and then ordinals will follow suit.

Speaker 2: 49:41

Yeah, and that's kind of what I was getting at with. Just my little take was for the mini foreseeable future there's not a lot that you know disco can pull off to not a lot of moves, and a lot of times I make moves just because I feel like, oh, activity will be get you know result. But at this point I think it's better to kind of refocus on the wonder and the excitement and the art and to really kind of find that and look at what kind of kind of gets you excited about the space overall, instead of, you know, trying to think you can impact something that's bigger than you.

Speaker 1: 50:12

Yeah, I mean, the more you move stuff around and for me for the last 10 years, the more I've bought and the more I've moved in general I would be. I I think I'd be wealthier if I just held the original Bitcoin and just kept stacking stats. In fact, I know I would be wealthier, but it is what it is and I don't regret having the art, but people just need to know.

Speaker 1: 50:33

Stack with all the stuff you see in your timeline. Stacking sats has to be your number one priority right now because there's. I think this is going to happen over the next 10 or 20 years, but this seismic shift and this transfer of wealth is only like this. This is going to be the biggest transfer of wealth I would imagine ever. Like. I don't. Maybe they're.

Speaker 1: 50:55

Historically there was something more. Land changed hands from some sort of uprising or or gold was pilfered somewhere and passed out to a lot of people. But I generally things aren't pilfered and passed to anybody. It's given to the strongest, biggest guy in the room, right. So this is the first time where we beat Silicon Valley. In most of them anyway, we beat the politicians in, we beat Wall Street in, we won, and now we get to see it play out again Like at some point.

Speaker 1: 51:23

Right now we're aligned to the Larry Finks and the big institutions, but at some point we might not be Like when they start making rules, like we need to make sure we can hold our private keys and all that stuff. So that will be a fight that we have to be not only. We have to be preemptive and proactive on that fight Cause at some point it may be, you know, it may be too late. You know, look at the Patriot act. They pass that when everybody's in panic, like they're. They're good at creating a huge swan of black swan diversion over here to to take more surveillance and power, and that that's one I think we have to. We have to be very serious about keeping our eye on and fighting.

Speaker 2: 52:05

A hundred percent. Um, I like the, I like the image, um, in the middle, representing the middle, representing the United States, and the kind of proliferation of Bitcoin. When you look, we think about some of the different buckets and how do we kind of filter through all of the news and think of what's relevant to folks, sticking to what we said before. But just over the past week, we've seen another state come in. Another state pension fund is now actively purchasing Bitcoin for its fund, and that's the state of Michigan. We also saw Jersey City come in for their pension fund to say that they're going to start purchasing it as well.

Speaker 2: 52:46

So we're just seeing this happen and people always go back to what they know. Well, so we're just seeing this happen, and I do, you know, people always go back to what they know before. So they're like oh, it's an arms race or it's this or that, but to some degree, since there is this, it goes back to the finite supply, like, since there is a finite supply and there's increasing demand and there's now long-term understanding of the value, that is what we're looking at now. It's a race and starting to see you know these different states. It must be states that are in pretty decent financial shape. You know and can do that and can make that play, but I think they're going to look back on this and look like legends. So it's interesting to see those stories pop out.

Speaker 1: 53:19

Yeah, and it also shows you that you know these bureaucrats in these states are. They've been orange pilled right, so you know it takes a lot. You know I'm I'm on the board of my little teeny town here and and I think I was thinking this morning it would be a disservice I'm sure I'll get scoffed at, but it will be a disservice for me not to propose to put at least 10% of our assets or savings into Bitcoin. And I know they'll be like Michigan did it, wisconsin did it. Now New Jersey I think it was a big city in New Jersey did it? Yeah?

Speaker 2: 53:58

New Jersey.

Speaker 1: 53:59

Yeah, I know Arizona, a couple of pension funds out there. Now we've got Hong Kong looking at it as a reserve strategy. Like slowly, suddenly, suddenly, all at once, and the. I'm shocked Like if, if, if. You would put in front of me disco like here's, I have a crystal ball, here's the timeline of 2024 in the news and what Trump announced, what RFK announced and Kamala Harris may be going on, and then these states doing it and you'd be like, okay, at the beginning of the year, bitcoin was at 62 000. What do you think it's going to be by july 31st? And I'd be like 130, I don't know. And it's still 66 000. Now we know the mount goxfud, uh, is finally going to over. They haven't doled it all out. I don't know what takes them so long. It's like just fucking pass it out, just send it.

Speaker 1: 54:55

Yeah, just send it and get it over with, because Kraken was supposed to only have 14 days, but I don't even know if they've moved there. So the Mt Gox money, I don't think it's not. We know that less a third is moved, but less than that has actually been sold on the marketplace. But to me, that's the last batch of FUD, but I guess it tells you one of two things that it's being manipulated at the biggest whale influencer level, which is obviously presidents, state actors, wall Street, the Larry Finks it has been fully co-opted, because you know, someone I was talking to at the conference are like dude, we can't move the needle, and where I disagree with him, though, is a bunch of us together can, but his point was it's being manipulated by in the billions of dollars.

Speaker 1: 55:44

Those are the whales that can collude whether they are or not, who knows but they can collude to makeude, to make Bitcoin go up and down, being a over trillion dollar asset. Now, 20 of us obviously can't make a dent, but all of us can. I just saw a stat that 51% of Bitcoin is owned by individuals, so the state actors have big swaths, but we still own, at least for now, the majority, and obviously, even through the Black Rocks. That's we own it, but they custody it, so that's it gets gray there, right? Not your keys, not your crypto.

Speaker 2: 56:21

So yeah, yeah. And then you saw that Russia is making moves to start utilizing crypto officially again. Um, they passed the legislation for being able to do international bitcoin payments as well as to start mining again. So big changes there. They haven't officially allowed it within, you know, within the state, but I would assume that might be coming as well.

Speaker 2: 56:48

So it it's all just. I mean again, it's just this overall adoption story. You're kind of seeing the, seeing the, the pipes being laid underneath it, and we kind of have that, not necessarily insider, but what's so cool about is you have such a higher level of transparency now, just because of the nature of you know what we're able to see and how it's happening. So it's it. We're going to start seeing more and more disclosures, I assume, of companies that are doing this or that. I know marathon digital.

Speaker 2: 57:16

They just bought another a hundred million in Bitcoin, not a hundred. They bought a hundred million in Bitcoin, so they're up to like 20,000 Bitcoin, and that's another example of what we talked about in the previous show of like, how are you a good financial steward of your corporation if you're not allocating something to this? It's funny kind of a tale to what you said about how you almost felt like you would not be doing a disservice to your town by not advocating to purchase it. I was talking to my son last night and he's part of this conservation group for jazz, for jazz and for the jazz arts, and I went to something that was spectacular. I was like I might, you know, I might offer to help the board and get involved, and he's like that's fine, but don't push him onto crypto dude. I'm like how did you know I would? He's like you're gonna say well, why don't you, you know, do this?

Speaker 1: 58:05

yeah all right, you're gonna embarrass me, dad um but, you know like you don't have to do a hundred percent, but do do some of it, because we both know if this does rip, if Bitcoin goes to like, let's say, my little town gets 0.1 or 0.2 Bitcoin, you know like barely nothing in 10 years they might be able to literally be like a self-sovereign town, where they're they're, they already have a stockpile and they don't even have to worry about raising these revenues or not, because you can make so much more from this. Now, it's a gamble, and a small town obviously probably wouldn't do a hundred percent of it. If it was my small town, I don't know if I do a 100%, because then you'd have the pitch forks after you and then you'd have to move.

Speaker 2: 58:54

Blue top list.

Speaker 1: 58:55

Blue top. She likes his little compound too much, but just some of it. The early you are in this adoption cycle whether you're a state company sovereign the earlier you are, the more like in 20, 30 years like you can make way different decisions about city planning and you know company planning. Because you might be like we're making so much more, you'll just go to the Bitcoin standard and be like why are we working?

Speaker 2: 59:40

We just need to buy more Bitcoin with what we have, and that's going to grow faster than we can generate revenue. How much better as a individual do you feel by being early and holding some stockpile of Bitcoin? As just an individual You're talking about, it'd be smart for a town to get 0.1 or whatever. So if you have 0.1, 0.5 or whatever for yourself and for your family, you should be feeling pretty good currents that we're, that we're seeing out there. So you know I don't want to pat everyone on the back, but when you start seeing you know divergent new, divergent takes and everything like that it's like really zoom, zoom back out and think about the fact that you're already have a seat in the theater and you should be pretty happy that you had the foresight to do it. So kudos to everyone who has. Yeah, no, a hundred percent, and it, it.

Speaker 1: 1:00:26

I mean I guess I'd throw it right back at you but to me it feels great because you know I do own a small company and I love it.

Speaker 1: 1:00:41

But as I get older I want to do more of what I love doing, which is talking to you on the show, talking, doing spaces with scribe and Steven, and just like following my passions.

Speaker 1: 1:00:50

And when I go, feel like going on a walk with my dog or my wife or my kids or whatever, or playing golf or whatever your hobby or or activity is, you can do more of that. I mean, the coolest thing is when you have a society, that of people that you know kind of made a bet and they bet on themselves and then they have the freedom to not be paycheck to paycheck anymore. That's when, like you were talking about what's the art going to be. That's when the art is going to be off the charts, because it's going to be people who have finally felt a freedom and they're not under the oppression of what none of us understood with economics, because you were never really taught. This is. This inflation, the silent tax and the silent theft is way more insidious than any of us had had previously thought. And now we have an exit ramp and it feels really good.

Speaker 2: 1:01:46

Yeah, a hundred percent. Ah, I noticed a shark.

Speaker 1: 1:01:51

Yeah, so solana, this one's worth mentioning. It's kind of an honorable mention for this week, but solana's uh shit, I it's their like a part of their chain did more daily than eth. I believe it was pump fun. Um, so PumpFun all the DGN meme coins and Solana did more in revenue than the entire ETH chain did. It was either yesterday or last week. I think it was yesterday, so I will say I am the first one to.

Speaker 1: 1:02:25

I made fun of Solana and it does still go down and I still make fun of it. I'm not going to buy my NFTs on there, because when things go down, I don't believe in IPFS, I don't believe in ROE, I only believe in Bitcoin and having things inscribed on sats immutably forever. But you cannot ignore Solana. I mean obviously Solana.

Speaker 1: 1:02:46

Meme coins are kicking Bitcoins, meme coins. There's over a million of them, probably 2 million by now. A million was the number last week and Solana is eating Ethereum's lunch. It just passed BNB, I believe, as the number four coin. So it doesn't matter what the hell I think about it and what my biases were, because my biases came from ETH and being a crypto punk. And now I'm in the ordinal space. And when we ripped. So did Solana. We ripped with ordinals, they ripped with meme coins and our ordinals came. Our runes and meme coins came later. But you got to tip the hat to Solana and it makes me I'm thinking very hard about. Maybe I'm not going to get rid of all my validators on ETH, but I'm tempted to get rid of at least one and or my CryptoPunk and maybe put it over in Solana.

Speaker 1: 1:03:36

I've already yeah, I've already put a bag over there from early in our show when we saw it ripping and I was like I'm not missing out on this. And we didn't. We, we caught uh, we didn't catch it from the beginning, at like when it was super down, bad, but we caught it pretty early and now it's still way up. So, yeah, I think Solana, if they keep going at this rate, I think they have room to rip and they've got partnerships with like Stripe. Nothing in this world is a no-brainer and Bitcoin and stackingats is number one, but Solana's proven to stick around, I feel like it's. It's very, it's held very centrally and it's hard to be a validator because you need very powerful machines to do it. So I don't love all the architecture, but it's getting adopted and adoption trumps. Whatever I think about it going down and stuff like that, it's a high. It has a higher risk profile because of that. But you know you can't, it can't be ignored.

Speaker 2: 1:04:36

Yeah, and I think that goes back to, you know, another theme that we've talked about, which is, you know, not necessarily you know graduating classes or freshmen classes or people coming in. But you know a lot of the newer people that have come in, you know, on this cycle, entered through Solana and they're probably sitting there like why would I go somewhere else and pay this or wait for this or do this or that? So you have your graduating class ethos. Most of the folks that have been in since maybe 16 or more are like I'm happy to pay a little bit more and wait a little bit more to have something inscribed and go through the process with Bitcoin. But you have other people that would be like dude, why would I do that? That's so annoying. What are we doing? I'm waiting forever and it's really just kind of how you came in and I definitely think that it represents kind of the next wave of a different generation of folks in there.

Speaker 2: 1:05:25

I don't know the X's and O's, I know I see a lot of stats, uh, you know volumes and this or that, and I assume that a lot of it's kind of you know flipping around and just a lot of high frequency stuff. So I don't know. We always say, or you always say, you know, a good chain is a busy chain, but you want to make sure that that activity is you know, is sound right.

Speaker 1: 1:05:56

And you want to make sure that it's. It's doing the, doing some, some fundamental things? Yeah, absolutely. And if you just look at um to your point, like here is just nfts and obviously this doesn't count the, the meme coins, which is actually way bigger on on solana. But look at the amount of people coming in the last seven days, so there was 87. There was 344,000 buyers of Solana NFTs in some capacity. Bitcoin had 38,000, 39,000, and Ethereum had 52,000. So Bitcoin and Ethereum are kind of similar in their ecosystems, definitely smaller. But Solana is the entry gateway drug and if you come into the entry gateway sometimes like I, you know you, you were the one who called me out on this a couple months ago Like just cause I call it the mother chain, it's, it's the mother chain to me, to new people, they're like Solana, transactions are cheaper, uh, so it's a whole different like ecosystem. But the younger folks if I was younger and I'd never been into any of it, I'd probably be Solana too.

Speaker 2: 1:06:53

Yeah, I was just moving my head because I was looking at that chart, because I think, do you think that you have to count? You know the roll-ups towards Ethereum, right? So you did see. You know Polygon had 142,000. So if you start adding those together, the immutable you know it's. I'm just there's a little. There's a little. There's a little you have. You have to give some credit to the l2s for ethereum. If you're looking at that overall, I guess it's the only point. Yeah I.

Speaker 1: 1:07:16

I would never trade nfts on l2s. I guess why I don't look at it. But you're right, that's. That's absolutely correct. It's about the ecosystem. Not all of these roll up into ethereum, which, uh, blue toshi doesn't like from a validator standpoint.

Speaker 1: 1:07:30

But yeah, the ecosystem is still healthy. But you know, solana uh definitely can't be ignored. So you know, of your 100 pie allocation, if I'm 80, 10 or maybe like 75, 15, 5 or something whatever. I don't know if that would do a hundred, but I would probably uh put Solana closer to ETH now. And I never thought, uh, I never thought there would be the day where I said that. And who knows, maybe this is uh zigging, when I should be just holding and letting Ethereum have its day. But remember, ethereum just lost.

Speaker 1: 1:08:05

Uh, ethereum ETF came out what? Last Tuesday, right? Or was that two Tuesdays ago? It's only been a week or two and their net inflows outflows. It's outflow 480 million, and I assume a lot of that came out of grayscale. Because how can you be negative on things that are brand new? But negative half a billion is not a good start to that's not a good start to anything to me. So the ETH ETF I didn't buy it, whereas the Bitcoin ETF from my retirement accounts, I did. So I'm not super bullish there, but maybe it's for all the same reasons before that I don't think the ETH ecosystem is getting used as enough and I don't think the innovation is happening there anymore.

Speaker 2: 1:08:49

The ecosystem is getting used as nothing. I don't think the innovation is happening there anymore, yeah, but to be fair, there was a shakeout period where you almost benefited by not getting in week one or day one on the Bitcoin rollout. So I think that you got to give it more time to kind of shake out. It's obviously not trending on the scale of you know the the impact of the Bitcoin, but as a standalone it could you know if you didn't have to compare it to that monster of a success story it may be doing okay.

Speaker 1: 1:09:18

Yeah, yeah, that's true, I don't know. So the the only last piece we have before we go. This one's a kind of funny, but uh, the the state of California DMV drivers, the Department of Driver Motor Vehicles is tokenizing the titles onto the Avalanche chain, correct?

Speaker 2: 1:09:43

Yeah, 42 million car titles are getting tokenized on Avalanche and first of all, if there's ever been and this is what I'm so excited about with it, right, like if there's ever been an organization or operation in need of you know, you know complete, just, or innovation and ground up, it's the freaking dmv. I don't think anyone's super bullish on the current practices and interface, so that alone that's exciting to see that they're looking at it. But then to see them go and it kind of is one of those realizations of the you know kind of tokenization and the real world assets that when I first got in was so intriguing to me. I was like, oh wait, you can use it this way or that. So to see it come to life in the largest state and to see it actually happen is fascinating.

Speaker 2: 1:10:26

My question on it is is so if it's on avalanche, do you think that holding avalanche, you would see a uptick in this if it then goes to all the different states? Or are we just seeing like different chains being utilized for completely distinctive purposes, like that's what I'm trying to kind of look through that. That was the big thing. It it's like okay, it's avalanche, so is avalanche going to look like they're more, you know, governmental focused and you know focus on that. And then as a holder, you know, are they going to get you know contracts and and stuff through the States to them and how would that impact holders down the down the kind of pipeline is my big question.

Speaker 1: 1:11:07

Yeah, the down, the kind of pipeline, is my big question. Yeah, I mean, any big news is obviously going to move a chain. I haven't uh point, pull up coin gecko. Um, I guess I'm focusing mainly on bitcoin, ordinals, runes, uh, for my investments. Obviously I'm still on ethereum and talked about solana. I don't know how far down the rabbit hole I want to go. I can't imagine I'll pull up coin gecko while we're talking, but I can't imagine it didn't positively affect Avalanche. It's down today, but let's just look in the last item.

Speaker 1: 1:11:39

So here's Avalanche, but here let's look, Seven day. Where are you?

Speaker 2: 1:11:48

On the top. Top, top there we go, thank you, thank you. So the one month so it didn't.

Speaker 1: 1:11:56

Doesn't look like it. Yeah, 24 hours. Yeah, I guess it went up a little, but no, and actually in seven days it's gone down, so the impact wasn't great. So I guess you'd have to judge it chain by chain. Um, I believe avalanche is just basically, it's like a copy of um, of ETH it's. It's kind of very similar to that, but I don't know. You know the.

Speaker 1: 1:12:20

The reason we brought this into the show at the end is because you know Larry Fink talks about tokenizing the world. I know disco. You're like my God, like now that Solana, like the SEC and mass, is just like all of these different tokens are not being considered securities. Uh, solana is the only one that pops up to me at the top of my head, but I think Avalanche might've been one of them. There's there's like five or six and you were like, well, how do we front run this and find the things? No, but it's a good call. Like is Uniswap. If they flip that switch on, it might be too late because there's so many copy pastas now that are cheaper, like the Cow one and SushiSwap. But if Uniswap flipped on that switch would owning Unitoken, would we be able to get that's the holy grail, right when we're holders of the coin. It's not on the stock market and we don't even have to look at the stock price because we're getting literal annuities for what these tokens are and that's where everything needs to go.

Speaker 1: 1:13:22

And you were the one because I was in Nashville or Nash Vegas, I guess we'll call it but meeting people really not paying attention to the news at all, and you were already thinking about that.

Speaker 1: 1:13:33

You're like this could be huge, and I think you're right. It's just a matter of like how long is this going to take? And you know, I just I I don't have a ton of faith that the regulators and government aren't still going to completely screw it up and make it like cause. I mean, if a Zuki could have just passed to the shareholders and didn't do that dumb ass, elemental, crappy launch that they did, and they were doing what they're doing now with like cartoons and stuff, and we could get some of the annuities from that in some form of token that has value, like ether, Solana or or Bitcoin, preferably, then I would still be bullish, but the fact that you still can't, it's not their fault, but it doesn't make me bullish yet. And you're saying well, front run somebody is I just it's, it's a, it's, that's a high risk thing so far. That will probably change over time, though.

Speaker 2: 1:14:27

Yeah, but I hear you but I would counter just to a degree. You know, we also have talked about how we're holding, you know, speculative bags of runes and we have more of a roadmap and more transparency on you know what Uniswap does, or so I'm not saying that it's a you know a layup or anything and not financial advice, but it's something I think I want to you know a layup or anything and not financial advice, but it's something I think I want to, you know, kind of explore a little bit more and maybe have some exposure to moving forward.

Speaker 1: 1:14:56

Oh, a hundred percent and I. That's a great thought. Yeah, it's a great thought and I think that's what keeps us going in this space. And again, we always joke about the rabbit holes, like Bitcoiners at that conference had that. They probably have 20 rabbit holes that they can go down and have conversations, but we ordinals runesers and ETH people and people who pay attention to Salon and other crypto we have like 180 rabbit holes. It's so nuanced and that's why we do this show. We tie these fabrics together, we bring the stories to you and we create a much bigger mosaic because everything is interconnected.

Speaker 2: 1:15:35

Totally so. We do this show for entertainment purposes. Nothing is designed to be financial advice. We encourage you to do your own research and make sure that you protect yourself from any liabilities or exposures. So be smart out there, enjoy the environment, have fun and learn and connect with the community from any, any uh liabilities or exposures. So be smart out there, enjoy kind of the, enjoy the environment, have fun and learn and and connect with the community, and I appreciate everyone taking their time this week and look forward to being back next week.

Speaker 1: 1:15:59

Yep Love doing the show with you Disco and uh, everybody listened to us in Apple podcast, spotify Cause. Again, we know that uh X isn't currently the place where you're just going to sit and watch a video, because then you can't I don't even think you can scroll.

Speaker 2: 1:16:14

No, you can't multitask.

Speaker 1: 1:16:15

Yeah, so just watching, we get it, but we know we're skating where the puck is going. But we're on Apple podcasts, spotify, listen to us or watch us on YouTube If you'd like to see the charts and stuff, amazon music and there's a million others. It's distributed everywhere RSS feeds, so follow us. Like it, comment on it, tell us what you want to talk about, if you have an interesting idea for the show. We love interviewing people. Um, I love asking questions. I will dive deeper than you are probably even used to, cause if I'm curious and if disco is curious, um, it will be an interesting show. So with that, everybody, thank you, take care, uh, and we will see you next week. Thanks.